tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post4265854220573596578..comments2023-10-14T09:40:06.690-05:00Comments on Jean Kazez: "Pescatarian"Jean Kazezhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-66098653704346340732011-06-12T21:15:57.987-05:002011-06-12T21:15:57.987-05:00I started on a vegan diet six months ago, and in m...I started on a vegan diet six months ago, and in my research discovered how many vegans and vegetarians are tradgically eating all these meat replacement (SOY) products, what a sad uneducated mistake many make, thinking they are being so healthy and noble, yet soy that is unfermented is worse than eating meat, from a health standpoint. it only takes a little research.<br />Now, to address the Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-9431598546695417582011-06-11T16:59:49.070-05:002011-06-11T16:59:49.070-05:00Just imagine if we, pescs, veggies(me) and vegans ...Just imagine if we, pescs, veggies(me) and vegans alike stopped worrying about the intricacies of our abstinence from eating animals and instead worked together to create awareness and encourage meat eaters to consider their daily mindless choices. The way food is packaged these days makes it so hard for people to associate their food with the real revolting trauma and pain of factory farming Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-48633498221958516442011-05-23T09:46:54.250-05:002011-05-23T09:46:54.250-05:00Hello .. Justin, I would just like to point out th...Hello .. Justin, I would just like to point out that the famous ethical Australian philospher Peter Singer's argument is flawed as he does not consider all life-forms equal and deserving of life .. If you read further in his philosphy and 'ethical thinking' you will discover he thinks it is okay to terminate the lives of babies who are born with learning disabilities - he believes KWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18335001094857381380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-75533492647491582942011-04-15T14:59:39.706-05:002011-04-15T14:59:39.706-05:00I am considering going full veggie and i have been...I am considering going full veggie and i have been a pesc for almost 7 years. I can somewhat understand the reasons why people do it. What i don't understand is the extreme scrutiny people make of others choices. You think by being a vegan you are not harming animals? What about the plot of land where your house sits? I'm sure no animals lived there before your home was built. What about Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-79454278720780680072011-01-05T17:57:02.840-06:002011-01-05T17:57:02.840-06:00I see both sides of the debate. I have been strug...I see both sides of the debate. I have been struggling this issue for a 2+ years. Initially I stopped eating all mammals and birds without a blink of an eye, but have a hard time giving up fish. I don't eat them very often, but I did get completely turned off when I was eating lobster and saw him staring back at me, I didn't even finish eating him.<br /><br />I am a teacher and one Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18332316820573594439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-29863691524134285442010-10-15T03:35:10.234-05:002010-10-15T03:35:10.234-05:00I agree with ed. People seem to get quiet worked u...I agree with ed. People seem to get quiet worked up about these things.<br /><br />There's worse things in the world that being a little bit of a hipocrite. It's impossible to avoid, and I'm not going to modify my oppinions and diet so I fit into an ideology.<br /><br />Avoiding death and suffering seems a little bit like burying heads in the sand. When these are inevitable.<br />And atticusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-79565732245038027412010-07-06T13:36:21.048-05:002010-07-06T13:36:21.048-05:00Gosh, I had no idea that there was such a debate r...Gosh, I had no idea that there was such a debate revolving around this topic. I'm new to this ( just three days in) and I started because I wanted to eat healthier without having to worry about supplementing protien with vitamins. I will just tell people ( when they offer me meat) no thanks, I'd rather have fish :)Toyhttp://pescatariandiet.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-27525658214975075432010-07-02T10:06:23.152-05:002010-07-02T10:06:23.152-05:00For all those interested in food and ethics, thi...For all those interested in food and ethics, this article by Johann Hari is a must-read.<br /><br />http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/07/02-1s. wallersteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17448905469871566228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-53991775593698450712010-07-01T09:43:32.783-05:002010-07-01T09:43:32.783-05:00Ed, Right, it's not exactly true that I'm ...Ed, Right, it's not exactly true that I'm a vegetarian, but for lots of reasons, not just because I eat fish. I'm also not totally scrupulous about other foods. I knowingly eat things that contain gelatin, for example, because it's just too much trouble to always avoid it. So I use "vegetarian" as a rough label, but will gladly admit to the whole truth and nothing but Jean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-16636166995847677392010-07-01T08:47:48.095-05:002010-07-01T08:47:48.095-05:00I applaud anybody who is doing anything to reduce ...I applaud anybody who is doing anything to reduce their support of animal cruelty. I'm not going to quibble over whether they are doing enough. If you are doing anything then I am a fan. <br /><br />However, if you are going to apply any kind of label to yourself I think you should do it accurately. The words "vegetarian" and "vegan" have actual defined meanings Edhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06399341362068645241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-52783680932731805202010-06-30T16:08:16.837-05:002010-06-30T16:08:16.837-05:00I don't eat fish either, I guess for the same...I don't eat fish either, I guess for the same reason I don't eat meat - a squeemish feeling about killing and eating things, the suffering, the unnecessariness of it, etc. An interesting article - <a href="http://www.gourmet.com/magazine/2000s/2004/08/consider_the_lobster" rel="nofollow">Consider the lobster</a> by David Foster Wallace.crystalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05681674503952991492noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-73643635499420134662010-06-30T15:59:54.175-05:002010-06-30T15:59:54.175-05:00I rarely eat fish, but approximately every other ...I rarely eat fish, but approximately every other month I eat dinner out with my son, age 31.<br />He eats both meat and fish, although he prefers meat. The only place in my part of town where you can eat a vegan meal is a Chinese restaurant, but my son detests Chinese food. So we eat fish. If I insist to him that we eat a vegan meal, he will question me why I prefer the suffering or s. wallersteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17448905469871566228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-49512658642599334792010-06-30T14:49:23.431-05:002010-06-30T14:49:23.431-05:00Fair enough, Jean, and of course some of those ben...Fair enough, Jean, and of course some of those benefits are not in any way trivial. It ultimately becomes a matter of personal choice about whether or not the gains are worth the costs. I would say no, those personal gains are not worth taking life, but I am not saying that is the universally right answer. I appreciate at the very least that you think about it all when you eat!!!!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10319551504917171165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-13602452272346683352010-06-30T14:40:31.679-05:002010-06-30T14:40:31.679-05:00I think we're all agreeing it's wrong to u...I think we're all agreeing it's wrong to use fish as food, and only disagreeing on why it's wrong, how wrong it is, how that wrong compares to other wrongs, etc. So--let's assume it's wrong. <br /><br />It doesn't follow that one shouldn't do it no matter what. There might be benefits you could obtain that would be worth doing that wrong. <br /><br />Most people thinkJean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-80623597657991270302010-06-30T14:29:12.319-05:002010-06-30T14:29:12.319-05:00But it is not just a matter of suffering. It is a ...But it is not <i>just</i> a matter of suffering. It is a matter of life and death. Your choice to eat meat (and I include fish and fowl in this use of "meat") involves the death of another living being solely for your own benefit, when you could choose otherwise. I think that is a more significant ethical matter than just whether or not the being suffers in the process, and that is why Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10319551504917171165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-72991862418346128622010-06-30T14:16:23.149-05:002010-06-30T14:16:23.149-05:00...but is it worthwhile to cut oneself off more, s...<i>...but is it worthwhile to cut oneself off more, so that fish suffer less</i><br /><br />Exactly--that's the question I struggle with.Jean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-79948232569602323012010-06-30T13:46:17.448-05:002010-06-30T13:46:17.448-05:00Not eating meat cuts one off from the rest of huma...Not eating meat cuts one off from the rest of humanity, and not eating fish, as Jean points out, cuts one off even more. In certain cases, for example, slavery, genocide, dictatorships, factory farming, etc., taking action which cuts one off from others is valid, but is it worthwhile to cut oneself off more, so that fish suffer less? Just being a thinking person isolates one, s. wallersteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17448905469871566228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-9534154728206410622010-06-30T11:27:10.390-05:002010-06-30T11:27:10.390-05:00Ah, okay, thank you, and sorry if I was confused a...Ah, okay, thank you, and sorry if I was confused about what you were saying--I think the comment about being "linked to the history of vegetarianism" threw me a bit. There is definitely a continuum relative to the capacities of the beings in question and the morality of killing them (as Singer recognizes--and you are right, he does not say killing is immoral/wrong per se, just that Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10319551504917171165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-17128597304501415142010-06-30T11:19:15.694-05:002010-06-30T11:19:15.694-05:00Justin, I'm not trying to defend eating fish o...Justin, I'm not trying to defend eating fish or reconcile it with vegetarian ethics, just trying to explain why a person might want to give up fish later than other things. I don't think that choice is simply arbitrary or simply hypocritical, for the reasons I discussed.Jean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-74991424369425928532010-06-30T10:57:27.819-05:002010-06-30T10:57:27.819-05:00Thank you for the response, Jean. I guess the hard...Thank you for the response, Jean. I guess the hard thing for me to understand with this is that vegetarianism espouses not eating meat because doing so requires killing. If you eat fish, you have to kill the fish. Yes, it may suffer less than another being would in some way in the whole process, but at the end is still the same result: premature death. If you know this fact--i.e., you know what Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10319551504917171165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-37678492595365074982010-06-30T10:44:56.864-05:002010-06-30T10:44:56.864-05:00Wayne, What Singer says about how fish are killed ...Wayne, What Singer says about how fish are killed in The Ethics of What We Eat has stuck with me. That and all the stuff about the environment has changed the way I think about these things.Jean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-59286218183853801332010-06-30T10:38:59.139-05:002010-06-30T10:38:59.139-05:00Singer really doesn't postulate a right to lif...Singer really doesn't postulate a right to life in AL, nor does he have a problem with killing per se. I don't think he'd morally equate eating plentiful, wild salmon and eating factory farmed chicken. In the first case, you are complicit in much less suffering than in the second, and that (simplifying a bit) is what really counts. In the salmon case, there is suffering at the Jean Kazezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00592593002719828153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-53479964132474065582010-06-30T10:33:50.070-05:002010-06-30T10:33:50.070-05:00Because of the popularity of salmon, people often ...Because of the popularity of salmon, people often mislabel salmon to either fetch a higher price, or to sell it out of season. http://www.imakenews.com/vitalchoiceseafood/e_article000389904.cfm<br />So your wild Alaskan Salmon might be farmed raised and injected with color.<br /><br />As for eating fish in general.... I wrestle with this one a lot. If I say that a demi-vegetarian is morally Waynehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08627147979307495870noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8310450667755637519.post-48075210754185415562010-06-30T10:27:22.393-05:002010-06-30T10:27:22.393-05:00I appreciate your comments, Jean, and more importa...I appreciate your comments, Jean, and more importantly the fact that you approach your food from a moral perspective. Of course, as a strict vegan, I disagree with you on this. My question is how you would respond to Peter Singer's basic argument in <i>Animal Liberation</i>, and which most non-eaters would agree with: that all living beings are equal when it comes to the basic rights of life Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10319551504917171165noreply@blogger.com